Mitsubishi Delica Owners Club UK™

[Pagan Celt]

Hi Guys,

Mitzi started making some very odd bubbling gurgling noises yesterday on a short run in heavy rain.
Saw the temp gauge come up but not above halfway.
Got home and popped the bonnet and sure enough clouds of steam and more gurgling. She appeared to be out of water so let her cool off and left her alone til today.
This morning went out and topped up with what turned out to be a great deal more - good 5L I reckon.so yeah, she was pretty much empty. Odd thing though, there seems to be a small stream of water coming out of the bottom, pretty much under where the power steering filler is above.
Once filled up I went to start her and first off got a sickly graunching noise, a bit like you get on trying to start a car thats been left in gear. 2nd go she fired but it was lumpy and struggled, although once she got going soon normalised.
Started off on a short run and got a repeat of yesterday's bubbling gurgling from the expansion tank, and the temp gauge started to go up. Stopped after about a mile, turned round and headed for home. Put the heater on full blast but nothing but cold air. Got home and found empty of water again and so went through the whole rigmarole again - this time the start was even harder and accompanied by clouds of white smoke out of the exhaust.
I have a horrible feeling that this is indeed a blown head gasket, and this post really is, as much as anything, a straw-clutching exercise in the hope that someone might have a less terminal diagnosis for me..
Failing that, anyone know anyone one in East Anglia who might like to tackle it? Or is it a better better to change the lump completely?

PC

[Google]

[Green Grouch]

Forgetting the head,  sounds like a pipe or connection has failed. There are a few in that area. A couple under the battery tray or something has come off the bottom of the expansion tank.?
Start taking bits off and have a good look. I'm sure you will find it quickly loosing that much Coolant.

When you have sorted that, you can look into your head. It may be okay. Touch wood, I've just survived an overheat from snapped alternator belts.
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A Little Knowledge is Dangerous and expensive! especially if your me Mending anything!!

[Pagan Celt]

Cheers for that GG.
I had a similar thought myself, and even had a little roll around underneath in the rain. But tbh the white smoke coming out of the exhaust and the boiling and back pressure in the expansion tank, kinda took the wind out of my sails

[andyman]

Difficult to start, white smoke - sounds like gasket or cracked head, although the amount of water sounds excessive for a gasket unless it has split. Will it idle once started? Usually the exhaust pees water out, and depending on its shape, can hold a lot of water causing a lot of back pressure. Take out the heater plugs and spin the engine over. See which cylinders spit water out. Hoping it is just the gasket, an engineer will be able to check whether the mating surfaces are flat enough to go back together (with a gasket) without the need to be skimmed first. There should be plenty of Mitsubishi-experienced mechanics in rural towns -  Mitsi pick-ups very popular with farmers, albeit they mostly use the 4D56 engine, but Shoguns used the 4M40.
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Andy C L300 Super Exceed - over 100 smiles per gallon!

[Pagan Celt]

Hi Andy,
It seems to idle okay once its run for a bit, although gets increasingly hot, natch.
Haven't tried the glowplug thing yet but will let you know when I do.
ON the drive when it did it it was in torrential rain and went through a good few huge puddles - seems unlikely but might that have caused a crack in the block? very cold water on a hot block etc?

Oh and good shout re the rural mechanic - ta

[andyman]

I doubt if you would get enough density of spray going through deep puddles, maybe if you waded into deep water. It is more likely that a leak from somewhere has caused overheating and caused the gasket to blow.
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Andy C L300 Super Exceed - over 100 smiles per gallon!

[Green Grouch]

I don't want to give false hope, but my belts snapped a month or so ago and I didn't notice immediately.  
Couldn't stop safely, so nursed her to where I could stop.  
Digi temp gauge showed 110, then hot,then just stars.  

Opened bonnet and the expansion tank was boiling big time.

After waiting a couple and a bit hours to get rescued home, I did start her again when cool to get her up the drive.

She sounded awful and lumpy as anything.  

A few weeks on and new belts, I've not noticed any Coolant loss or anything not going right.  

I may suffer later on, from this but as I said touch wood!

I even asked the knowledgeable on here where to get a good head.

Sort your leak and see what happens.  
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A Little Knowledge is Dangerous and expensive! especially if your me Mending anything!!

[mattb]

Mine boiled up due to water pump issue. temp gauge never lifted more than half.
New water pump and an extra temperature guage on the block itself and good as new.

[Pagan Celt]

okay - its official. Head gasket or worse (may even be a cracked block)

So I'm weighing up options - take the hit and sell her as is for spares
Or try and rebuild....  

So all opinions very welcome...

Try to make certain its "just" the gasket ?
Just how big a mission is an engine swap?
Is there such a thing as a reliable source for a new lump?
Is there any mileage in considering an upgrade to a 3.2 4M41

Whaddya reckon guys?

[Lewis]

If it was a cracked block then you would be easily able to tell by the steam stains. Plus water would drain out as you filled it.

You don't need to swap the entire engine. Just replace the cylinder head and a good quality gasket.  


As for the 3.2 4M41; you will have problems with the wiring loom and ECU, which cannot be reprogrammed or replaced.
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Copyright is retained for all my photos. Please don't copy them without asking permission
Do not blindly go where the path may lead you. Go where there is no path and leave a trail that others may follow!
ルイス

[Pagan Celt]

Hey Lewis.
As it happens, water is/was coming out from the front righthand (as you look at it) side as it was being put into the expansion tank.
Had a buddy do a test with the rubber bulb and blue liquid in the expansion tank - said it changed colour faster than any he'd ever seen. ie the worst
I've done heads on other vehicles before but never one of these - are there known nightmare aspects or is it pretty straightforward?
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1995 LWB Super Exceed       2006 SWB Chamonix
4M40 2.8 TD                        PD6W 3L V6
Crsytallite Roof

[Lewis]

That doesn't sound too hopeful.  

Replacing the head is pretty normal. There is an option of using an original one or an aftermarket one.

With the original you require a specific thickness of gasket to match the pistons, of which there are four different heights. It's only marginal but the gaskets have a set of notches in the back edge, so you know which fits.

Alternatively if you go for a decent quality none OEM head then you can Also fit a set of replacement pistons and rings. Unlike the OEM head it will not have ceramic combustion chamber liners, so if there is a future issue you can get it skimmed. I chose that option on a previous Deli I owned and it resulted in a small increase in the piston volume, making it much closer to a 3L engine than the original 2,830cc.  
_________________


Copyright is retained for all my photos. Please don't copy them without asking permission
Do not blindly go where the path may lead you. Go where there is no path and leave a trail that others may follow!
ルイス

[Pagan Celt]

So, looks like I can get a recon engine fitted for around £1200 all in.
But...its already cost me loads since I bought it.
Any idea what I could expect to get for it if I cave in and sell it now?
Body pretty tidy, new turbo, radiator, water pump, alternator, 4 new BF Goodrich road tyres...

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1995 LWB Super Exceed       2006 SWB Chamonix
4M40 2.8 TD                        PD6W 3L V6
Crsytallite Roof

[Lewis]

The answer to that is simple.

'The smallest amount you are prepared to accept from a scrap dealer/ Breaker.'

Selling individual parts yourself will make more than selling it whole, as a non runner.

When it is sold the new owner has to pay upfront for car tax, only the MoT runs on until its expiry date. With no engine they won't be interested other than as scrap or spares.

If you don't want to go down the route of replacing the engine, get a replacemnt first and swap over all the good parts from the old to the new, including internal bits. Keep extra parts you may need in the future.
_________________


Copyright is retained for all my photos. Please don't copy them without asking permission
Do not blindly go where the path may lead you. Go where there is no path and leave a trail that others may follow!
ルイス

[Pagan Celt]

Yeah - daft question I guess lol
okay so heres maybe a better one (and the answers may give me enough to persuade the wife not to chuck in the towel just yet, so think carefully guys).
With a new lump what's the going rate for one of these beauties?
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1995 LWB Super Exceed       2006 SWB Chamonix
4M40 2.8 TD                        PD6W 3L V6
Crsytallite Roof

[skiorsail]

Alarm bells ring when I hear of recon engine , try googling recon engine con, even if genuine with new cylinder liners if they don't bore it out properly it seizes after a few hundred miles,been there with shogun v.expensive,and the extras they add can double your cost , the original engine can still run fine after 250,000  miles, if it's otherwise okay just get the gasket /head done by someone with a good track record.or make friends with a knowledgeable helper. As they get rarer second hand prices have been recovering for any non rusted example. I bought a complete spare  4m40 engine for 250 just by shopping around and just used the head .
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Delica chamonix PE8W 96.love at first sight.
Delica jasper PE8W 96 -green outside yellow inside - prev owner died smoke inhalation ?
plus Deli chamonix 2-at the price of a few months fuel who can resist. Plus toyota celica.